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#61 Simmy

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Posted 19 April 2005 - 11:20 PM

And just think boo, I might have another pic to share in here soon, givin its a fairy pic :unsure:

#62 Simmy

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 05:26 PM

BUMP! I'm bumping this up for my own selfish reasons lol...Anyone else have any interesting encounter stories with fairies?

#63 Markway

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 07:40 PM

Simmy:

I am very pleased to see this topic renewed. This topic like several others deserves greater and continual attention.

I read in the latest edition of Fate magazine, that Stephen Wagner has released the new list of most reported "paranormal" creatures. They are, in order of appearance: 1.) Bigfoot, 2.)Lake Monsters, 3.) Chupacabras, 4.) The Jersey Devil, 5.) Mothman 6.) Elves and fairies 7.) The Dover Demon, 8.) The Loveland Lizard, 9.) Living Dinosaurs, 10.) Springheeled Jack.

There are other phenomena which are important, especially the gateway, and haunted location topics. When I say haunted location, I mean areas which seem to have something wild and weird about them which attracts paranormal activity, and not places which have become haunted due to human activity.

I have never seen a fairy, although I still hope. (Anyone interested in this topic should make it a priority to read W.B. Yeats' " Celtic Twilight". It is truly beautiful and informative at the same time.

Edited by Markway, 10 July 2005 - 07:44 PM.

Take this kiss upon the brow!
And, in parting from you now,
This much let me avow---
You are not wrong, who deem
That my days have been a dream:
Yet if hope has flown away In a night,
Or in a day, In a vision, or in none,
Is it therefore the less gone?
All that we see or seem
Is but a dream within a dream.

#64 Oniix

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 02:42 PM

LOL, now... why is Elvis grouped in with fairies?


It made me think (I lost at least two brain cells trying to do that) how a person can "swallow" some aspects of the paranormal, but not others

*points at self*

Fairies.... the wee folk! I've known people that seem to see and deal with them all the time!

#65 Vampchick21

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 03:05 PM

LOL, now... why is Elvis grouped in with fairies?


It made me think (I lost at least two brain cells trying to do that) how a person can "swallow" some aspects of the paranormal, but not others

*points at self* 

Fairies.... the wee folk!  I've known people that seem to see and deal with them all the time!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



LMAO!!!

I had to read Markway's post three times to see this. He actually said Elves. Not Elvis....lol..Like...Kebler Elves. ;)

But you do make a very good point. How can a person believe in one paranormal thing and not another? Heck, I do....I believe in ghosts and the wee folk and multiple deities, but roll my eyes heavenward when looking over UFO stuff.

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#66 Oniix

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 03:23 PM

hahaha! I completely missed that. Must have Elvis on my mind for some reason... would explain the dead brain cells! I could edit that but it's too funy ;)

Well, remember, UFOs are not truly considered to be part of parapsychology. Actually, cyrptozology isn't part of parapsychology. So where do elves (ELVES, not Elvis as I seem to want to think) fit? part of magic? cryptozology? Remember magic and witchcraft are not part of parapsychology either.... just in case anyone was trying to make the link hehe.


BUT! they are unknowns, so I suppose since they are not really closely linked (or so one would think) perhaps it's not strange at all to believe one and not the other.

I like to think outloud in threads.... I need a banana.

#67 Vampchick21

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 03:42 PM

Hrmmmm....where to start?

Yeah, UFO's generally aren't considered 'paranormal pheonomena' in the proper sense, but I lump it in there because abduction stories to me are far to similar to old stories of people abducted by the wee folk (only the wee folk didn't...ummm...probe) In that sense, I consider them a modern fairy story more than anything.

Cryptzoology often ends up under the parapsychology banner. Partially, I think, because of the mystical quality of so many of the creatures in that field. And I think perhaps elves (elvis elves.....LMAO) would fall into the field, along with their brethern because they are a mystical creature.

Magic and witchcraft tend to fall in there somewhere, many is the time I have seen a perfectly serious paranormal investigating group use the services of a witch because the witch is able to somehow communicate with the other side. (not all of us can do that though, I sure can't). So magic and witchcraft seem to fall on the line inbetween...it's definitly a religion, and it's also a tool in parapsychology sometimes.

<hands Life a Banana>

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#68 Oniix

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 04:12 PM

Oh yeah, I certainly understand how they do get grouped together, I agree with why they do as well, for formalities sake, they shouldn't, but they always do. I think some people here just need the clarification, that parapsychology does not study UFO, bigfoot, or fairies..... I have no idea why I brought that up. Anyway, on to your regularily scheduled thread.

Well, what kind of evidence to we have of fairies to look at for this discussion? What kinds of reports? What kinds of photo, audio, or video evidence? Do we have any data from or analyzing techniques?

#69 Vampchick21

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 05:28 PM

Not that I'm aware of, but since there are organizations and groups out there that do these things for just about every other creature/phenomena, I'm certain one exists on the same level for the Wee Folk.

I'll take a look about this evening after CSI and see what I can find. I know of a few, rather flakey, sites that certaintly don't qualify, but ya never know what's out there.

I do, however, know that reports have be around for centuries, not to mention guidelines to interacting with these beings. And being Irish, I tend to view them under the concept of having been the race that once occupied Ireland prior to the coming of the Sons of Mil (yeah, I'll post a link to that whole thing later....lol)

There were a set of photos put out in the public arena back in the 19th century, however, these were later proven to be fakes beyond any doubt.

Until later!

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#70 Vampchick21

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Posted 11 July 2005 - 07:28 PM

k...here are some site on those hoax photos I mentioned

The Cottingley Fairies

The Case of the Cottingley Fairies

A documentary (don't know what all the site contains)

The Fairy Faith

Ancient Irish legends

The Milesian Legends

Tuatha de Danaan

Who were the Tuatha De Danaan?

So far, no research organizations, but I'll keep looking

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#71 Markway

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Posted 12 July 2005 - 02:51 AM

Hi guys!

I need to manually check these sites more often. I rely upon the automated notafication of new posts exclusively, and did not receive news that this discussion was going on until this evening!

FYI, this topic has been bouncing around GV for quite as long as I've been here. As a matter of fact, I got into a rather strange debate with Plindboe over a fairy shoe in our marathon confab on the Skeptic's board. This led to me being pursued by a researcher writing a book on the little people, looking for my sources, and another person with similar motives from the Discovery channel!

Surprisingly, there is so much information about fairies and so on that it can make your head swim. For starters; the Cottingsley fairy photo hoax is/was never resolved. Two sisters were involved. They lived with their parents in one of the areas of the British Isles most commonly reported to have fairies, or at least fairy sightings. The forest next to their home was notorious for the same thing. Both girls at one time claimed to have seen and interacted with fairies. Now, here's where the story becomes nasty. One sister claimed her whole life that nothing was seen, and that the photos were fakes. The other sister claimed, right up to her death bed, and beyond for all I know, that they HAD played with the fairies, and had managed to photograph one or two, but the girls didn't feel that the pictures were satisfying or showed enough, so they cut out illustrations from books and used them for the majority of the photos.

What intrigues me about this is that I own a copy of the original book of photos printed from the Cottingley incident. It does NOT contain several other weird, and much more believable pictures that I have seen elsewhere. One showed a long-legged grotesque, while the other was a sort of smeary swoop with a humanoid figure in the forward part.

As a sometime Anthropologist I can tell you that for centuries exceptionally tiny arrowheads called "Elf Shot", pottery, and functional clay pipes so small, that a man cannot insert the tip of his little finger into the bowl have been found in Ireland and southern Scotland, close to a place called Melrose. If I was lecturing on the subject, I would describe the pieces as ritual objects, designed to please, the miniature demons which "so clearly play a part in Celtic folklore. Check in your texts for; "Cetyn Y Tylwyth Teg".

The shoe is what gets me. Back in the the first couple of decades of the 19th century, a rather simple farmer found a fairy shoe alonf a muddy trail. It scared the BAD_WORD out of him, and he couldn't wait to get rid of it. This goofy shoe is under 3" long, and shows insole wear in the shape of a foot and heel wear, as if it had indeed been worn. Somehow, the goofy thing was examined at Harvard University, before they knew better, or on account of a big Irish contribution, I don't know, but, no one could figure out how it was put together until then. Apparently, the stitches were microscopic, and the material used to stitch them together was some sort of hair. The leather was moleskin I believe. This isn't the only shoe.

What IS the Paranormal? As God is my witness I cannot say with any certainty. The book I am/was writing was meant to help clear this issue up. The problem is that the more you research UFO's for example, the less they look like visitors from outer space. The more you investigate Sasquatches the more you find that the sightings start to overlap with UFO's. These are not the only phenomena which have overlap, but the answer does not seem to lie in the human brain, which is why I am still interested.

By the way, I stick with the Men In Black, " Elvis didn't die, he just went home." :blush:

Edited by Markway, 12 July 2005 - 03:01 AM.

Take this kiss upon the brow!
And, in parting from you now,
This much let me avow---
You are not wrong, who deem
That my days have been a dream:
Yet if hope has flown away In a night,
Or in a day, In a vision, or in none,
Is it therefore the less gone?
All that we see or seem
Is but a dream within a dream.

#72 Oniix

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Posted 12 July 2005 - 08:27 AM

Some great points Markway. I remember this conversation on the boot. Markway, is there any information on this available on the net? The boot that is...

Well now you have me interested in another topic! lol

#73 Simmy

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Posted 12 July 2005 - 07:08 PM

Markaway, very interesting stuff!! I have seen that movie about the little girls and the fairys, Is there any links that you know of that show those pictures you mention? or can you scan them? I would LOVE to see them! Also, any info on the shoe?

Thanks for the info!

Simmy

#74 Markway

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Posted 13 July 2005 - 12:59 AM

As far as the Cottingley incident is concerned, I have a copy of the picture showing the long-legged grotesque, but not the other. I'm afraid that most of my research took place during the print media era. I might be able to scan the one picture if I knew how to do it and if I could find the drivers for a Canon Multipass, MP390. After my computer meltdown my copier doesn't work, and twin No. 2 doesn't remember what he did with the discs. If I can find them in the next couple of days I'll ask for instructions as to scanning and posting them. (Sorry to be so stupid about computers). The bottom line is; ask me for book titles, not net links.

Please consider reading two books. One of my very favorites is "Celtic Twilight", by W. B. Yeats. It is a beautifully written book, with a focus on real encounter, and folklore at the same time, as well as being wonderfully written. The second is a kind of chintzy paperback called "Fairies" by Janet Bord. It has a lot of the information I posess which is easy to read and encapsulate. It has a picture of the shoe and so on. If you want to read the actual findings from Harvard concerning their examination it is pretty BAD_WORD hard. See? I'm back to that woman writing her book, and the Discovery channel.

There seems to be an absolute belief in the gentry in areas where they're known. There is a lot of belief in and confusion between the dead and the "Gentry". What they believe these creatures are.
Take this kiss upon the brow!
And, in parting from you now,
This much let me avow---
You are not wrong, who deem
That my days have been a dream:
Yet if hope has flown away In a night,
Or in a day, In a vision, or in none,
Is it therefore the less gone?
All that we see or seem
Is but a dream within a dream.

#75 Vampchick21

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    Looks Irish, loves Italian food, lives in Canada....must be lost

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Posted 13 July 2005 - 08:18 AM

Markway, speaking as someone raised within a prominantly Irish culture (my grandmother was an Irish War Bride, my father was born in Ireland and hence, I had a strong Irish influence growing up), the Gentry (you NEVER EVER call them by their proper name, else you unwittingly attract the less desirable elements among them) were once the race that populated Ireland prior to the arrival of the Sons of Mil and the ensuing battle. The Sons of Mil won and the Gentry were given the part of Ireland underground, accessed through certain hills, caves, wells, lakes, rivers and ponds. In fact, the Gentry were the second race to populate Ireland, they took it from the Formorians, beings of chaos who still show up now and again. The entity in Leap Castle in Ireland, as far as I am concerned, is a Formorian.

I highly recommend you take a look at the Tuatha De Danaan links I provided above. It was after the Irish were converted to Christianity that the Gentry were considered to be fallen angels (not devils or demons, just fallen angels). But my understanding of them is what I noted above, an early race that lost to the Sons of Mil, and on a few occassions intermarried with them (Ireland...or Erie, got it's name from one of the Tuatha De Danaan ladies)

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