77 replies to this topic

[JimDe]

canuck, on Sep 18 2008, 01:24 AM, said:

All true, but in light of the widely acknowledged extraordinary difficulty in obtaining “evidence” of the existence of spooks, and the limited explanatory value of such evidence, we have stipulated that they do exist.

Given that stipulation, we are moving forward in an attempt to gain meaning from the preponderance of data that is available. It is non productive, and very tedious, to rehash old arguments.

This is not an unprecedented approach, in fact most of the advances of science have been the ultimate result of just such an approach.

The question of clothing, while interesting as a peripheral issue, is not really of sufficient significance to divert us from the primary thrust of the investigations.

The objective IMO has always been a singular one; a physical spirit occurrence. I believe that someday paranormal science will ultimately advance to a point whereby they can induce consistent occurrences, but as of today science remains unable to produce physical manifestations of ‘ghosts’ in the lab or in the field even while acknowledging their existence as credible. What’s up with that?

It’s obviously not due to lack of interest, intelligence or ingenuity, spiritual beings (ghosts) have been suggested for at least four thousand years (so stipulated). Considering the technological advances available to the contemporary scientist and as you say the preponderance of data that is available, why has this issue not yet been resolved?

[canuck]

JimDe, on Sep 24 2008, 12:01 AM, said:

canuck, on Sep 18 2008, 01:24 AM, said:

All true, but in light of the widely acknowledged extraordinary difficulty in obtaining “evidence” of the existence of spooks, and the limited explanatory value of such evidence, we have stipulated that they do exist.

Given that stipulation, we are moving forward in an attempt to gain meaning from the preponderance of data that is available. It is non productive, and very tedious, to rehash old arguments.

This is not an unprecedented approach, in fact most of the advances of science have been the ultimate result of just such an approach.

The question of clothing, while interesting as a peripheral issue, is not really of sufficient significance to divert us from the primary thrust of the investigations.

The objective IMO has always been a singular one; a physical spirit occurrence. I believe that someday paranormal science will ultimately advance to a point whereby they can induce consistent occurrences, but as of today science remains unable to produce physical manifestations of ‘ghosts’ in the lab or in the field even while acknowledging their existence as credible. What’s up with that?

It’s obviously not due to lack of interest, intelligence or ingenuity, spiritual beings (ghosts) have been suggested for at least four thousand years (so stipulated). Considering the technological advances available to the contemporary scientist and as you say the preponderance of data that is available, why has this issue not yet been resolved?

Probably the most efficient way of getting the answers to your questions is to review some of the previous threads that discussed this very topic.

You will note that there was a lot of entertainment value to be had in poking a stick at the self proclaimed cheerleaders for science; but the most conspicuous thing that came out of these fun and games was the profound ignorance of both science and the processes of science that was demonstrated by these cheerleaders.

I draw your attention to this, because that ignorance encapsulates the answer to your question.

[JimDe]

canuck, on Sep 25 2008, 09:46 PM, said:

You will note that there was a lot of entertainment value to be had in poking a stick at the self proclaimed cheerleaders for science; but the most conspicuous thing that came out of these fun and games was the profound ignorance of both science and the processes of science that was demonstrated by these cheerleaders.

I draw your attention to this, because that ignorance encapsulates the answer to your question.

I wasn’t looking to affix blame or insinuate incompetence …just making a point. Considering that 99+ % of the population suffers from a similar inability to capture/produce paranormal anomalies (particularly on a consistent basis - if at all),
I’m not convinced that ignorance is a fair assessment of the overall situation.

It’s obvious that the scientific methods, procedures and protocols so aptly applied under common physical conditions do not apply to actual paranormal phenomena - have never applied to actual paranormal phenomena and judging by the progress (or lack thereof) made over the last several hundred years it’s highly unlikely that such a system will even be forthcoming in our lifetime

Not to mention that if science could produce such anomalies under controlled experimental conditions then it would no longer be considered paranormal and this discussion would be addressing an entirely different set of speculative phenomena such as aliens, demons and paranormal furniture, all of which suffer the same lack of reasonable evidence to substantiate a credible existence to an objective observer.

Edited by JimDe, 30 September 2008 - 12:43 PM.