18 replies to this topic

[Must_See_To_Believe]

aloha_spirit, on Jan 27 2011, 12:03 AM, said:

Must_See_To_Believe, on Jan 23 2011, 03:38 PM, said:

Tell that to the Baptists who think Mormons are going to hell and the Mormons who think everyone is going to hell but them... or the Muslims who want to kill everyone that doesn't believe as they do. It is still not politically motivated. It is nothing more than a world-wide Jihad, if you will, on everyone who vigorously practices their religion.

I belong to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, more commonly known as "Mormon". If you were familiar with Mormonism, you would be surprised at how mistaken you are about our beliefs on hell.

Mormons believe there are two places which can be called hell. The first is the abode of spirits being purged for their sins before they can be judged and resurrected. Everyone (Mormon and non-Mormon alike) passes through this purging. The other hell is often called "Outer Darkness" and lasts forever. Outer Darkness is reserved for only the vilest of sinners. Most people will enter a kingdom of glory in heaven. Everyone receives a different degree of glory based on how well they lived their life.

Sorry I've never responded to anyone's reply to my post but I forgot all about writing this.

To Moon... I actually think we agree more than it appears that we do. Point taken and apologies for my stuffiness.

To Aloha... no.. I doubt I would be surprised. What I had said is a common Baptist "joke" and not a very good one at that. However, what you did not refute was the jokes' assumption that Mormon's still think everyone but them is going to hell. A laughable observation on a not-so-funny pun.

Personally, I believe there is Heaven and there is hell..nothing in between. The only religions that speak of any "limbo" out there are the ones who have "alternate' 'bible' books that refute what the Holy Bible says while still saying the Bible is God's Holy Word...even if God's Holy Word says nothing about any limbo. God wrote the Bible, right?? The alternate books were written by man. BIG difference.

[aloha_spirit]

Must_See_To_Believe, on Sep 30 2011, 08:17 PM, said:

aloha_spirit, on Jan 27 2011, 12:03 AM, said:

Must_See_To_Believe, on Jan 23 2011, 03:38 PM, said:

Tell that to the Baptists who think Mormons are going to hell and the Mormons who think everyone is going to hell but them... or the Muslims who want to kill everyone that doesn't believe as they do. It is still not politically motivated. It is nothing more than a world-wide Jihad, if you will, on everyone who vigorously practices their religion.

I belong to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, more commonly known as "Mormon". If you were familiar with Mormonism, you would be surprised at how mistaken you are about our beliefs on hell.

Mormons believe there are two places which can be called hell. The first is the abode of spirits being purged for their sins before they can be judged and resurrected. Everyone (Mormon and non-Mormon alike) passes through this purging. The other hell is often called "Outer Darkness" and lasts forever. Outer Darkness is reserved for only the vilest of sinners. Most people will enter a kingdom of glory in heaven. Everyone receives a different degree of glory based on how well they lived their life.

Sorry I've never responded to anyone's reply to my post but I forgot all about writing this.

To Aloha... no.. I doubt I would be surprised. What I had said is a common Baptist "joke" and not a very good one at that. However, what you did not refute was the jokes' assumption that Mormon's still think everyone but them is going to hell. A laughable observation on a not-so-funny pun.

Personally, I believe there is Heaven and there is hell..nothing in between. The only religions that speak of any "limbo" out there are the ones who have "alternate' 'bible' books that refute what the Holy Bible says while still saying the Bible is God's Holy Word...even if God's Holy Word says nothing about any limbo. God wrote the Bible, right?? The alternate books were written by man. BIG difference.

LdS don't believe in limbo. The LdS belief of multiple degrees of glories does have a biblical basis. Jesus said that in his Father's house are many mansions. Paul talked of this comparing them to the sun, the moon, and the stars.

[CaveRat2]

Sorry, I don't buy the multiple degrees either. Consider

Ephesians2:8-10 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Thus it is clear we are all expected to do these works, but that is not a requirement for, nor represents any degree of salvation. Heaven is heaven; all the same. True there may be some recognition to some who have gone beyond in some way (i.e. mention of "crowns" elsewhere.) but it is not a factor nor represents any division in heaven. To me it equates to the recognition given your neighbor here for some good work he did. Worthy of course, but it doesn't generally give him a bigger nor better house than yours.

Regarding limbo, that is not scriptural as was pointed out earlier. Only some obscure manuscripts and human interpretations support it. In fact, do a little digging and a similar idea of purgatory is actually found to be a concept invented by the Catholic church early on as a means of income for the church. This was one of the reasons leading to the Reformation in the 14th - 16th centuries.

Back in those days the priest would hold over a deceased person's family certain "sins" and for a nominal fee would offer to pray the soul of the departed into heaven. Records were kept and if a family did not "give" at the level determined necessary they would be held accountable.

Of course that was then and this is now. I don't believe the catholic church still holds these beliefs but the idea of purgatory still is taught. (I am not going to go into all the details here, do some research and you can find support for this claim!)

Now I don't know how the LdS concept of multiple hells relates to this, but do they also believe one can be "prayed" into heaven? Show me one scriptural case of anyone ever being prayed into heaven! those in hell (i.e. Lazarus for example) are doomed to hell forever. they are not even given an opportunity to reach out and warn the living of their plight. (Lazarus tried but was refused.)

Finally regarding the statement many will enter heaven I rdisagree. Reference

Mathew 7:12-14 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."

Someone much more knowledgable than I made that statement! Something to think about.....

[aloha_spirit]

Regarding multiple hells, like I said LdS believe the term hell can only be applied to two states. The first comes from the Hebrew word Shoel - a place where spirits await the resurrection. The second is outer darkness, the lake of fire, etc. Multiple heavens more closely lines up with Mormonism (Celestial, Terrestrial, Telestial). Mormonism doesn't believe in the Catholic concept of limbo.

LdS don't believe that someone can be prayed to heaven per se, but we do perform proxy ordinances (such as baptism) for the dead. We believe the dead may choose to accept or reject such ordinances.