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Number of the Beast,616?


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#1 Willow

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Posted 02 May 2005 - 10:25 PM

Revelation! 666 is not the number of the beast
(it's a devilish 616)


A newly discovered fragment of the oldest surviving copy of the New Testament indicates that, as far as the Antichrist goes, theologians, scholars, heavy metal groups, and television evangelists have got the wrong number. Instead of 666, it's actually the far less ominous 616.

The new fragment from the Book of Revelation, written in ancient Greek and dating from the late third century, is part of a hoard of previously unintelligible manuscripts discovered in historic dumps outside Oxyrhynchus in Egypt. Now a team of expert classicists, using new photographic techniques, are finally deciphering the original writing.

http://news.independ...sp?story=634679
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#2 nohara_megami

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 12:20 AM

wow, that would cause people to rethink that wouldn't they.... I guess the bumper sticker I wanted would be void now..... 667-Neighbor of the Beast lol
Hellsing: In the name of God, impure souls of the living dead shall be banished into eternal damnation. Amen.I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!Rome did not create an empire by having meetings. They did it by killing those who opposed them.Witches... Not just for burning.

#3 MoonChild

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 12:37 AM

Do you mind if I laugh out loud? :unsure: :unsure:


Do I have permission to blame media? Do I have permission to blame human fear? Do I have permission to blame bad judgement? Do I have permission to blame lack of proper knowledge?

Numerologically speaking, 666 adds up to 18 = 9 (1+8), which is the number of mankind, and the "beast". 616 adds up to 13 = 4 (1+3), which happens to be the spiritual number. There are lot of instances in the religious history where 13 has played a major role, so perhaps 616 could infact be the "beastly" number, since it is unattainable for common man without spiritual growth. 4 infact is a number denoting Karmic bondages/salvation.
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#4 aloha_spirit

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 12:53 AM

In Greek, 666 is written εξακόσια εξήντα έξι
The number 616 is written εξακόσια δέκα έξι

Do εξήντα (60) and δέκα (10) look similar enough to be mistaken for each other?

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#5 MoonChild

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 12:59 AM

hhhmmmm so how about other's like 20 or 30 or 40 or 50? Do they look similiar too?
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#6 aloha_spirit

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 01:27 AM

δέκα => 10
είκοσι => 20
τριάντα => 30
σαράντα => 40
πενήντα => 50
εξήντα => 60
εβδομήντα => 70
ογδόντα => 80
ενενήντα => 90

Of course, this is assuming the numbers were spelled out and not represented with Hebrew letters (in a fashion of Gematria).

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#7 little_light

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 07:40 AM

Wow...Good find Willow....And thanks aloha...

Can I laugh with you Moon? :lol:
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#8 celestial_kel

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 08:17 AM

I've always been more suspicious of the number "13"! I hate that number.....it just feels weird :blink:
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#9 petunia4998

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Posted 03 May 2005 - 11:57 AM

This is so funny. How many other things we swear are truisms are based on mistakes? I'll bet it's a staggering number. And that's why I don't believe in the bible. How many languages has it been translated into and how many mistakes have been made?
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#10 Yosei

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Posted 04 May 2005 - 04:19 PM

4 infact is a number denoting Karmic bondages/salvation.

Unless you are in China or Japan, where 4 is the number of Death... :huh:
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#11 DukeofBoogie

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Posted 04 May 2005 - 07:10 PM

wow, that would cause people to rethink that wouldn't they.... I guess the bumper sticker I wanted would be void now..... 667-Neighbor of the Beast lol

Hey, I just bought that bumper sticker :P
http://www.facebook....59567008?v=wallhttp://www.cdbaby.co...eblackriverboyshttp://www.zoarcivilwar.com/In great deeds something abides. On great fields something stays.....Spirits linger, to consecrate ground for the vision place of souls. And reverent men and women from afar, and generations that know us not and that we know not of, heart-drawn to where and by whom great things were suffered and done for them, shall come to this deathless field, to ponder and dream; and lo! The shadow of a mighty presence shall wrap them in its bosom, and the power of the vision pass into thier soles.-Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain


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#12 nohara_megami

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Posted 04 May 2005 - 08:08 PM

I agree with you petunia, that is why I do not believe in the bible either. I mean, it is like poetry, which intreperter is right? Each language has its own symbolism in words, so what interpretation of the bible is true?

And celestial_kel, I personally like the number 13^_^ It has always been good to me:)
Hellsing: In the name of God, impure souls of the living dead shall be banished into eternal damnation. Amen.I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!Rome did not create an empire by having meetings. They did it by killing those who opposed them.Witches... Not just for burning.

#13 angelinayorke

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Posted 04 May 2005 - 08:13 PM

The number 13 for me is historical. The Friday the 13th came from the day that all the Knights Templar were arrested tortured and eventually killed by orders of King Phillip the Fair of France.
From time to time, I do get nostalgic and a little spooked...
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#14 nohara_megami

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Posted 04 May 2005 - 08:14 PM

I haveno historical connections to it, but Friday trhe 13th has always been a good day for me, rooting for next weeks Friday!!!! lol
Hellsing: In the name of God, impure souls of the living dead shall be banished into eternal damnation. Amen.I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!Rome did not create an empire by having meetings. They did it by killing those who opposed them.Witches... Not just for burning.

#15 angelinayorke

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Posted 04 May 2005 - 08:19 PM

Here are some excerpts on the reason the number 13 is considered "unlucky"

http://urbanlegends...._the_13th_2.htm

To the ancient Egyptians, we are told, life was a quest for spiritual ascension which unfolded in stages 12 in this life and a 13th beyond, thought to be the eternal afterlife. The number 13 therefore symbolized death not in terms of dust and decay, but as a glorious and desirable transformation. Though Egyptian civilization perished, the death symbolism they conferred on the number 13 survived, only to be corrupted by later cultures who associated it with a fear of death instead of a reverence for the afterlife.

Anathema

Other sources suggest the number 13 was purposely vilified by the founders of patriarchal religions in the early days of western civilization because it represented femininity. Thirteen had been revered in prehistoric goddess-worshiping cultures, allegedly, because it corresponded to the number of lunar (menstrual) cycles in a year (13 x 28 = 364 days). The "Earth Mother of Laussel," for example, a 27,000-year-old carving found near the Lascaux caves in France often cited as an icon of matriarchal spirituality, depicts a female figure holding a cresent-shaped horn bearing 13 notches. According to this theory, as the solar calendar triumphed over the lunar with the rise of male-dominated civilization, so did the number 12 over the number 13, thereafter considered anathema.

On the other hand, one of the earliest concrete taboos associated with the number 13 a taboo still observed by some superstitious folks today, apparently is said to have originated in the East with the Hindus, who believed, for reasons I haven't been able to ascertain, that it is always unlucky for 13 people to gather in one place say, at dinner. Interestingly enough, exactly the same superstition has been attributed to the ancient Vikings, though I have also been told that this and the accompanying mythological explanation are apocryphal. In any case, the story has been handed down as follows: Loki, the Evil One

Twelve gods were invited to a banquet at Valhalla. Loki, the Evil One, god of mischief, had been excluded from the guest list but crashed the party anyway, bringing the total number of attendees to 13. True to character, Loki raised hell by inciting Hod, the blind god of winter, to attack Balder the Good, who was a favorite of the gods. Hod took a spear of mistletoe offered by Loki and obediently hurled it at Balder, killing him instantly. All Valhalla grieved. And although one might take the moral of this story to be "Beware of uninvited guests bearing mistletoe," the Norse themselves apparently concluded that 13 people at a dinner party is just plain bad luck.

As if to prove the point, the Bible tells us there were exactly 13 present at the Last Supper. One of the dinner guests er, disciples betrayed Jesus Christ, setting the stage for the Crucifixion.

Did I mention the Crucifixion took place on a Friday?

The Witch-Goddess

The name "Friday" came from a Norse deity worshipped on the sixth day, known either as Frigg (goddess of marriage and fertility), or Freya (goddess of sex and fertility), or both, the two figures having become intertwined in the handing-down of myths over time (the etymology of "Friday" has been given both ways). Frigg/Freya corresponded to Venus, the goddess of love of the Romans, who named the sixth day of the week in her honor "dies Veneris."

Friday was actually considered quite lucky by pre-Christian Teutonic peoples, we are told especially as a day to get married because of its traditional association with love and fertility. All that changed when Christianity came along. The goddess of the sixth day most likely Freya in this context, given that the cat was her sacred animal was recast in post-pagan folklore as a witch, and her day became associated with evil doings.

Various legends developed in that vein, but one is of particular interest: As the story goes, the witches of the north used to observe their sabbath by gathering in a cemetery in the dark of the moon. On one such occasion the Friday goddess, Freya herself, came down from her sanctuary in the mountaintops and appeared before the group, who numbered only 12 at the time, and gave them one of her cats, after which the witches' coven and, by tradition, every properly-formed coven since comprised exactly 13.


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